Supplements, Nutrients and Psychedelics for Sleep, Focus, and Connection With Dr. Scott Sherr

Dr. Scott Sherr has been a frequent guest and audience favorite with his information-dense guest appearances on The SuperAge Show. This week, we speak about new information on some of the brain chemical influences on depression, sleep, and anxiety — specifically, the overlooked neurotransmitter GABA. We review the symptoms of GABA dysregulation and the methods for correcting it. Dr Sherr is a clinician, meaning he sees patients and comes at the issues from a more nuanced point of view than pure researchers sometimes do. In the middle of the episode, Dr. Scott brings up a surprisingly simple, zero-risk method to increase sleep effectiveness. Toward the end of the conversation, David asks about how to increase focus and concentration, and we get into the practical usage of nicotine, methyl blue, and low-dose psychedelics such as LSD and psilocybin.

Additionally, don’t forget to check out the all-new SuperAge Quiz!

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Key Moments
“So, when I do analysis with patients, I’m usually looking at a gamut of types of labs and, looking at these labs, what I found over the last several years is that GABA is a big problem. And it’s not GABA itself that you’re typically looking at, but you’re actually looking at some of the amino acids and some of the cofactors that are typically deficient in these kinds of patients that are having symptoms that are very much correlated with GABA deficiency, and some of those are symptoms that all of us have gone through in our life. From a mental health perspective, we know GABA deficiency is associated with anxiety, with fear, with depression, with short temper, with phobias, with impulsiveness, with disorganization, and addiction.”

“The problem with GABA as a supplement is that it’s a very big molecule and it doesn’t cross the blood-brain barrier very easily at all. There are only a couple of different ways to get GABA through. One of them is using something called nicotinoyl GABA, or vitamin B3 attached to a GABA.”

“Cava is a GABA agonist so it helps increase the amount of GABA that binds. It doesn’t bind to that GABA site itself, it binds to a separate site a little further away, but it helps with increasing the amount of GABA that’s going to bind and you’re going to have that feeling of feeling like you’ve had a couple beers, kind of thing. But the nice thing about cava is it doesn’t bind with the same affinity and it also binds to other receptors that help increase wakefulness.”

“The first part of this conversation is that nicotine is a fantastic cognitive enhancer. It’s very short acting. It’s about one to two hours and, if you don’t smoke it or vape it, keep it very low, and dose less than four milligrams a day. The chance of addiction is minutely small; minuscule. So it’s very, very powerful and very quick. And so, for people that are looking to feel more of a cognitive edge, they can actually just have some nicotine on its own and it will do that.”

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Transcript

David: 0:15

Hey Scott, how are you today? Hey Dave, nice to see you again. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 0:18

Good to see you and where are you today? So I lived just outside of Boulder, colorado, about 10 minutes away. Nice little, sleepy town called Lewisville. If you were in Kentucky it would be pronounced Louisville, but here in Colorado we say it like Americans and it’s Lewisville. Yes, nice little town. I’ve been here for about two years, just about. It’s a beautiful place to be and his Winter started, fall started. So we were just getting the, the early inclinations last week. It was beautiful. The nice thing about living here is that in the evenings it gets, it’s a very dry climate and when it’s hot outside it stays warm at night. And I lived in California for many years and always would cool down at night, which is very nice. For air conditioning, right, you have your natural air conditioning outside, you just open up your windows. But here it’s nice because it stays a little bit warmer so you can stay out in the evenings and it’s. We had like a beautiful party, like just a lot of dinner party on Saturday night, which I don’t typically do With friends and and with our kids and things like that. It was a lot of fun. So, yes, small, bite-sized pieces of fall. For now, the challenge was living in Colorado is that your middle seasons, your spring and your fall, tend to be Really short sometimes. So it’s like, all of a sudden it’s like winter tomorrow. I’m like I think this Friday it’s supposed to be 60 degrees and and raining. I’m like, really I’m not ready for that yet. Man, like the winters here are long, I mean they’re beautiful, like though the mountains are 45 minutes away from my house. We, we got ski passes. Of course I’m getting gear this year. We’re getting roof racks and blah blah. I’m becoming. I’m becoming like a full Colorado in here, david. It’s just it could give you a couple more years. I’m gonna have all the gear, probably. 

David: 2:01

I mean last year. I mean it started to heavily snow mid October. I Skied through the middle of June. Yeah, it’s like it’s the endless winter. My wife went crazy. She’s like we’re gonna get out of here. I can’t live like this. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 2:15

Yeah, you guys got dumped on. I know with California as well, like Utah was was part of that, the whole dumping process of of snow. So yeah, it could be a lot of fun if you love this, if you love the snow, but if you don’t, you gotta get a dodge, that’s for sure. 

David: 2:29

We had a conversation a couple of weeks ago. Yeah, and I just want to let everybody know, you’re like my go-to guy when I have like. So I was gonna have surgery and you know, before we have surgery, I call you up and it’s like, okay, what do I need to do here to prevent bad things from happening and healing? So we had this conversation and you give me all my protocols, which are awesome. I’m good at following instructions, so I’m following them. And one of the things that came up in our conversation was Gabba, which is something I hadn’t really thought. I mean, it’s heard of it, but I hadn’t really thought too much about it. What is Gabba? What does it do? Sure, Sure. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 3:02

So Everybody knows about serotonin, everybody knows about dopamine, everybody knows about norepinephrine or adrenaline it’s the same name for the same thing. But everybody has less that they know about Gabba. And Gabba is a neurotransmitter gamma amida butyric acid and Gabba is our most important inhibitory neurotransmitter. Means that it calms down the firing of the brain, and it’s Situated all over the brain, but it’s also situated in these places where it’s actually called something called an interneuron. So basically, it helps Regulate the processing of all those superstar neurotransmitter neurons your dopamine and serotonin, your norepinephrine. Gabba is usually somewhere in the middle of all that Regulating flow, and so it has this amazing ability to just help the our Information processing, our memory, our learning, our skill acquisition. But it’s doing it in an inhibitory way, which means it’s actually relaxing the firing of neurons as opposed to stimulating that all those other neuron types and neurotransmitters will do. And Gabba is always in balance With an excitatory neurotransmitter called glutamate. It’s another one that a lot of people don’t know about, but glutamate and Gabba together actually make up almost about 80% of your entire brain’s neurotransmission. So you don’t know about it, but glutamate and Gabba are running the show for the most part, and so glutamate is you’re an excitatory neurotransmitter. It’s the one that gives you. It gives you drive, it gives you focus, it gives you, if you’re over glutamated, so like that’s not a word, but it like, for example, if you’ve had MSG. So MSG which is it found in a lot of Asian cooking to make it sweeter monosodium glutamate. If you’re like me, you take some monosodium glutamate Accidentally at a Chinese restaurant and you start getting an instant headache. That is an over excitatory stimulus Causing you to have a headache. So you have glutamate, which is your excitatory neurotransmitter, and then in the brain, glutamate gets actually converted into Gabba via an enzyme and vitamin B6 and magnesium. So you need to have B6 and magnesium to be able to do this Efficiently. And so you have this balance between this excitatory neurotransmitter, glutamate, and this inhibitory neurotransmitter, gabba, and Gabba is Associated of many different things as a result of it’s being an inhibitory type of neurotransmitter. 

David: 5:27

Your clinician yes, not, not a researcher, which I love speaking to clinicians because you actually deal with humans, indeed, doing meta analysis in your practice, what are you seeing in terms of Gabba as a clinician? 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 5:40

Yeah, so it’s a really good question. This is, this is how I always the lens that I always use, I mean there’s you can read studies until your eyes are going to fall out. Epidemiology meta-analyses they can be important but and this is kind of a slight side track soapbox. But if you’re listening to people that don’t see patients for a living, it’s very difficult For you to be able to translate what they’re saying to your own personal life. You may get some ideas. Don’t get me wrong. I think researchers can be fantastic about talking about topics and diving deep into various kinds of things, and there’s some very, very popular Podcasts out there that get millions and millions and millions of people that are looking at them. But most of these guys and women are researchers. They do not see people for a living, they do not know the nuances of working with individuals, and so whenever you’re looking at advice from these kinds of people, I have a colleague of mine that calls it chauffeur information. It’s the guy in the front that’s telling you what to do, but he’s actually not doing anything Except for driving like he’s driving the car, but like you know that’s. You know in this case that it’s it’s information that’s coming secondhand, or it’s only personal stuff that works for that particular person and you don’t know if that really translates to you. So, as the soapbox there is that when you’re looking at information out there and you’re listening to podcast or listening to YouTube or wherever else you get your information from, these days Nobody listens to the or reads in New York Times anymore, or whatever. Just make sure that you’re looking at in that context. It can be very helpful. But look it in the context that does this person actually see patients for a living? And then in my world you lose an edge when you stop doing it. It’s just plain and simple. It’s like when you stop working. It’s like anything else. If you stop seeing people, you stop being able to get that perspective. And this is classic, for like a hospital administrator that used to be a doctor and that now they don’t see patients anymore and now they only care about is how much money the hospital is making. They forget what it is to see patients and what that means and the nuances of all that. But anyway, that’s my soapbox. I’m sure you could agree with that. 

David: 7:46

I just wanna 100% agree with you. It is like one of my pet peeves People who are researchers, who often heroes of podcasting, but they’re not clinicians, so they’re saying things as if hey, do X, this is gonna change your life, like well, maybe, maybe not, and they don’t have that patient responsibility and they’re not seeing how incredibly complex human biology are also different and like a clinician would never say that. A clinician would say, well, let’s have a look at that, that might work, that might not work, let’s see what its effects are. They’re not gonna be as dogmatic. Anyway, I agree 100%. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 8:28

Yeah, yeah, it’s a nuance that’s very much lost. When you’re looking to portray something on social media, for example, that has maybe some benefit, but there could be some downsides that may not work for everybody. There’s a lot of nuances there. So, looking for clinicians out there that are doing the work and I have a lot of good friends that have great podcasts that are clinicians that do amazing things, and I’m not saying that people that don’t see patients aren’t helpful, but just take it with a grain of salt. If they’re telling you their sleep stack or their morning routine or like their, whatever, it might be their food during the day or what I did, it can be so many different examples. But anyway, over to to GABA deficiency. So in clinical practice it’s interesting because when somebody comes to you they’ll have all often times they’ll have a whole bunch of things going on right. They have fatigue, they’re stressed, they have anxiety, they’re depressed or they’re just feeling pretty good overall, but they still wanna feel better, right? It’s a huge gamut of things, and so what I would typically do and this is how I kind of initially got more interested in GABA deficiency is that I do a full panel with people. Like I have a practice, a concierge medical practice. It’s called health optimization, medicine and practice. That’s the framework that I use. It’s a nonprofit organization training doctors and practitioners like me to how to optimize health rather than treat disease, and it’s looking at foundational biomarkers, something called metabolomics, and metabolomics is basically how you can assess metabolism, assess how well your cells are working in real time, and we’ve talked a lot about I’m sure you’ve talked about this on your podcast, dave and other people what metabolic health, what is metabolic health, and who is metabolically healthy and who is not metabolically healthy. It’s a big deal, and that 95% of the US population is not metabolically healthy, which means that they have some problem with their metabolism, whether it is processing their macronutrients, their proteins, their carbohydrates, their fats by making energy. They don’t make energy well. They have insulin resistance, they have ongoing inflammation, they have gut problems, they have a leaky gut, they have a leaky brain. All these things are all relegated to what we call mitochondrial dysfunction. So when I do analysis with patients, I’m usually looking at a gamut of types of labs and looking at these labs, what I found over the last several years is that GABA is a big problem, and it’s not GABA itself that you’re typically looking at, but you’re actually looking at some of the amino acids and some of the cofactors that are typically deficient in these kinds of patients that are having symptoms like that are very much correlated with GABA deficiency, and some of those are symptoms that all of us have gone through in our life or that have family members so like. From a mental health perspective, we know GABA deficiency is associated with anxiety, with fear, with depression, with short temper, with phobias, with impulsiveness, with disorganization, with addictions. The biggest addiction obviously would be alcoholism, because if you’re drinking alcohol, you’re actually moduling the GABA system, so the predilection to alcoholism may be because you have a GABA deficiency. Even schizophrenia and OCD are associated with GABA deficiency. There’s also systemic symptoms like IBS and diarrhea, high blood pressure, chronic pain, allergies, migraines, frequent urination the list goes on. And so it’s but it’s not always just because of GABA, and so you don’t know that, and so you start looking at some of the things under the hood, and then you can look at various cofactors that are responsible for the conversion of glutamate to GABA, specifically vitamin B6 and magnesium. So if you’re deficient in magnesium or vitamin B6, you’re not gonna be able to do this conversion very well, and so if I see people that are vitamin B6 and magnesium deficient, which is a lot of people, I start giving them B6, I start giving them magnesium, I start optimizing cellular metabolism. They start feeling better and then you know that you’re optimizing their balance between their glutamate and their GABA system. So the symptoms are very let’s call them nondescript, in the sense that they can be ones that we’ve all heard about before. There’s nothing special about GABA symptoms, gaba deficiency, just in the setting of understanding that it needs to be on my clinical radar that this is going on. And you have your amino acid, specifically glutamine. Glutamine is the amino acid that we can take in our body so that you get glutamine from meat you get it from actually cabbage, from bone broths, from cheeses and other foods. And if you can actually look at your glutamine levels in the body and say, okay, well, if I’m glutamine deficient, I’m obviously not going to be making enough GABA, because glutamine gets turned into glutamate and then glutamate gets turned into GABA. So these are the things that I think about. So how are your glutamine levels? What kind of foods are you eating? And there’s a lot of other great things about glutamine as well, by the way. It’s not just that it makes glutamate and GABA is also really important for the fuel. It’s one of the fuel sources of your colonocytes or of your colon cells themselves, and that’s why we can take glutamine as a way to help heal up the gut if you have leaky gut. We also know glutamine is really important if you’ve had a surgery and this is actually what you and I were talking about a couple of weeks ago before you had surgeries. But glutamine is a very essential amino acid for recovery when you have a major, what we call a catabolic process, where the body is starting to break down in the setting of a stress, and so you need more glutamine. Your glutamine reserves go down dramatically when that’s the case. So that’s why you need more glutamine, and to actually increase the amount of glutamine you’re taking during a surgical process or a catabolic type of process like that. 

David: 14:18

You can buy GABA as a supplement you can, but it doesn’t work. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 14:23

Okay, okay, great. Yeah, the problem with GABA as a supplement is that it’s a very big molecule and it doesn’t cross the blood brain barrier very easily at all. There are only a couple of different ways to get GABA through. One of them is using something called nicotinol GABA or vitamin B3 attached to a GABA. My company Transcriptions has a product in it that has nicotinol GABA in it, specifically because when vitamin B3 is attached to a GABA molecule, it allows vitamin B3 to go first and then GABA follows through the transporters that allow it through the blood-brain barrier. Then, when it gets in the brain, it hydrolyzes or breaks up into vitamin B3 and into GABA. It goes directly into the brain that way, giving you increased GABA. You have increased vitamin B3 as well. Vitamin B3 is niacinamide vitamin, nad, so it gives you an NAD source as well. The nice thing about nicotinol GABA is that it helps increase GABA in the brain, but it doesn’t make you feel tired because it gives you the vitamin B3 as well. The GABA receptor itself in the brain is very interesting. I think this is where the conversation likely should go. Gaba itself attaches to the GABA receptor. There’s a specific spot on that receptor where GABA attaches. But there’s also these other spots on the GABA receptor as well where other things can attach and increase GABA levels in the brain. The most common one, the most widely used one, is alcohol. Alcohol has a site next to where the GABA typically would bind and it binds on that receptor, increasing the amount of GABA that attaches and as a result of that, you get more inhibition. Everybody knows when they drink alcohol you’re less inhibited in some ways and that’s because it’s called a disinhibition. You’re more active as a result of having more GABA at play. Think about this If you’re inhibiting an inhibitor, what do you have? You have more excitation, right, until you get to a certain point where you have so much GABA that’s bound because you’ve drank a lot of alcohol. Now you’re getting slow, now you’re getting sleepy. It completely screws up your sleep, which we can talk about, but alcohol does. But it makes you slower and makes you sleepier. Alcohol is the most commonly used drug that will modulate the GABA system. Then you have things like benzodiazepines, the ativans, valiums of the world, your Z-drugs, your sleep drugs, your ambience, your lunestas all affecting the GABA system. But the problem with those drugs, and alcohol as well, is that they bind so tightly to their sites on that receptor that they have a huge risk for you to have dependence, tolerance and withdrawal. You want to avoid those things. Alcohol is probably fine in low doses for some people. There’s pretty good evidence that no amount of alcohol is really healthy for you at this point. Some people may argue, and I’m okay with it, but I don’t know what’s your sense of alcohol these days. You have to give me, david. 

David: 17:32

My personal feeling is you have to balance. There’s certain social positives to alcohol, absolutely In small doses. I’m not a scientist, I’m not a doctor, but I don’t see any positive biological impact from alcohol. It all looks negative to me and creates sleep disorders, like a lot of things. But on the other hand, you want to hang out with your buddies and have a beer and talk, especially with guys who have some trouble talking to each other unless they have beer. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 17:59

I think that’s a positive. It’s funny because I was actually having a conversation with a friend a couple of days ago when I had that dinner party at the house You’re talking about as a guy. Typically, the way you hang out with other guys up until some point in your life is you go out to the bar and get a beer or get a drink and you watch a game or whatever it might be. It’s certainly as you get more interested in this work, as you have and as I have. It’s like what do you do with friends Then? Would you just change friends? That’s also possible. I know you evolve and my friends from high school. I stopped drinking three or four years ago at this point because I just don’t see any reason to do it. I have other ways to take stress off. I have other ways to relax, and making that transition is hard. I do think that maybe a little bit of alcohol every once in a while is probably fine. It does modulate the GABA system. I think there’s other, nicer ways to modulate the GABA system, not by taking GABA supplements as we described, but there are some natural things that enhance the GABA system natural products like herbs and things that we can talk about that are very good at helping enhance the GABA system without having the potential downsides that you would have with some of these prescription drugs. But the affinity to that receptor that we were talking about is not as significant as your alcohol and your benzos and your things like that. 

David: 19:11

You’ve just given me an idea. A lot of people drink alcohol. There’s sort of this long tail effect right, right, it’s just sleeping and stuff like that. There’s certain these molecules are really sticky. Is there something like an herb or supplement or something you can take with your alcohol to make it less sticky, so that it clears your brain quicker? 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 19:32

That’s a good question. I know various types of protocols that help with the other aspects of alcohol, which is the detoxification process, the dehydration process, the mineral deficiencies that you’ll get that are relative, because it’s causing dehydration and it’s causing a diuretic effect. I don’t know of anything specifically and you have to be really careful here because there are certain drugs that do antagonize or basically block the GABA system, but these are not typically used clinically because they can cause seizures. Actually, there’s one drug that’s used for benzodiazepine overdose. It’s called flumazenil and it’s a drug that actually blocks the GABA receptor and it works, but it also causes seizures because all of a sudden you’re blocking the entire thing, so you have no more inhibition. There’s all this excitation and as a result of that, you can have seizures Not used. There is one interesting compound that you’ll like. That’s called a reverse agonist, but doesn’t matter. The idea here is it’s actually from it’s called harmolin or harmolin, and harmolin is part of the ayahuasca ceremony. Harmolin is an inhibitor of the GABA receptor and as a result of that, when you have these ayahuasca experiences and you’re having DMT, harmolin is what’s called an MAOI inhibitor, so it blocks liver metabolism of DMT, which is why DMT can last for three to four hours instead of just 15 minutes or less if you smoke it or something like that. But harmolin itself is also a GABA antagonist, so it blocks the GABA receptor. That’s why people will feel pretty awake when they’re on this drug. At the same time it’s doing these other things, ginkgo is actually a GABA antagonist as well, so if you take some ginkgo it’s also going to block that receptor a little bit, so that’s going to give you more feeling of wakefulness as well. So there are a couple of things that you can do, but in general there’s no like antidote for the affinity or the binding, as far as I’m aware of alcohol itself. But I think the I mean. So you have. Like the most common alternative although it’s not that common but it’s relatively common is cava. So you’ve heard of cava before, I’m sure. Cava is a GABA agonist so it helps increase the amount of GABA that binds. It doesn’t bind to that GABA site itself, it binds to a separate site a little further away, but it helps with increasing the amount of GABA that’s going to bind and you’re going to have that feeling of feeling like you’ve had a couple beers, kind of thing. But the thing, the nice thing about cava is it doesn’t bind with the same affinity and it also binds to other receptors that help increase wakefulness. So you don’t have like the drunkenness kind of tired thing that you typically will with cava, unless you have a lot of it. But I’ve never done that. But I’ve heard people going to cava bars and having like lots of cava. But cava has been around for thousands of years. It’s an indigenous plant in the South Pacific and it’s been used in that way for many years as a way to relax, as a ceremonial kind of thing. So cava is great. So you have cava and you have nicotinol, gaba the one I mentioned before which are really nice because they don’t give you as much of a sedation kind of feeling. But if you’re looking for sedation, that’s also something that’s reasonable. If you have trouble sleeping, gaba is actually really important because GABA sticks with you all night and suppresses all those other neurotransmitters that are trying to keep you awake, especially during REM sleep. As you can imagine, rem sleep is a very active time. That’s when you’re dreaming, you’re thinking that you’re flying on an airplane, that you’re jumping out of off a cliff, but you don’t wake up somehow most of the time, and the reason why you don’t is actually because of GABA. So if you’re GABA deficient, you’re going to have more waking during your evenings, especially during REM sleep, interestingly enough, because REM is really an active. If you look at somebody’s brain during REM sleep, it’s extremely active. It looks like you’re awake actually, but you’re not, except the GABA system is keeping you from actually waking up. So there are certain GABA molecules or GABA herbals that might be helpful for people that are looking for more sedation kind of quality, without, obviously, the risk tolerance of withdrawal and things like that. The most common one is used out there as valerian root. Valerian’s been around forever. It stinks. It’s not a very good smelling compound, but valerian itself. The active compound in it is called valeric acid, and valeric acid is a great inducer of sleep and helps with maintenance as well. So there’s some other ones. Another one that we use is something called honeycoyle. Honeycoyle is something from Magnolia Bark Magnolia Bark I’m not sure where that grows, but Magnolia Bark’s active component is something called honeycoyle and then, even more active is something called dihydrohonicoyl beta or DHHB, and it’s a fantastic sleep inducer as well. And what’s nice about DHHB or honeycoyle is it’s relatively long acting, so it’s going to stay in the system for a while to help you kind of maintain some of that sleep. And then we’re working on a new compound that’s going to be coming out in October in our sleep trochee that we’re making. It’s called agarine or musselmol, and this is a. It’s actually a GABA. It binds to the GABA receptor at the GABA site and it’s a derivative of the fly agaric mushroom, which most of us know, some of us know from Santa Claus mythology. It is the mushroom of potential psychedelic experiences that brought on Santa Claus back in many thousands of years ago. Reindeer would eat this mushroom, and they would. Then the shaman would then drink the urine of the reindeer because these mushrooms are toxic, not because of the musselmol in them but because of another compound called ibotenic acid in it. But it would be detoxified in the urine. So the shaman would drink the urine from these reindeer and have psychedelic experiences. So anyway, but this particular compound. 

David: 25:38

Not really, I’m not willing to go there, I’m just saying. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 25:40

You’re not going to, so then the next step would be so the shaman would drink the reindeer urine, and then those that were being officiated by the shaman would drink the urine of the shaman. Second generation P Second generation P, exactly, yeah Right, but anyway, this is an amazing compound. Musselmol, or also called agron, is a fantastic sleep inducer and maintenance, because at last the half-life is about seven hours, so it will maintain you throughout the evening, and so we’re working on that in our sleep trochee as well. So anyway, that’s like an overall overview of ways you can sort of enhance the GABA system, at least pharmaceutical or medicinally, and there are other ways outside of that too. 

David: 26:23

We’re all different. Valerian, I feel drunk the next day if I have valerian tea and Cava. I’ve had it in a couple of different forms. I think one I had was pretty powerful and I was like drunk. I was just like, oh my God, you are not gabbed efficient, dave, no. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 26:46

And that’s actually. There’s a couple of diagnostic things here Like. One is that if you’re extremely sensitive to valerian or Cava, you might have a higher binding affinity. Number one, or and more likely, is that you’re just not gabbed efficient Like you’re actually like oftentimes, if people have a significant response to these kinds of things, it’s because they are gabbed efficient and it’s diagnostic in that way. And if, but if you’re feeling like drunk for the next day after you take it, you’re probably not gabbed efficient, you’re probably don’t need to take a whole lot of that stuff, right? But the other piece of this is that if people are taking regular gabba supplements and they’re still feeling the effects of gabba, it could mean that you have a leaky brain actually, because it oh, hypothetically, the gabba is not supposed to get across the blood-brain barrier. And if it is if you’re taking a gabba supplement that says gabba on it and you’re feeling like you’re fatigued and tired because of it, it could be because you have a leaky brain. Now, don’t worry, this just means that you have a leaky gut and this is fixable. Okay, people get scared when you say that, but it usually means you have a leaky gut. Or it could be chronic infection, chronic inflammation. There’s a lot of reasons why this could be the case, but it’s almost diagnostic in some ways that if people tell me that they feel like extremely tired from gabba supplements by themselves, it’s usually because they’re often leaky in some other location. 

David: 28:06

Yeah, I, calvin Valerian. For me they’re almost in the realm of benzos. Like it’s like, yeah, I can’t do that stuff. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 28:16

Yeah, and you shouldn’t right If you’re that sensitive to it. But something like nicotinol gabba might be interesting to you Like. We have our TROCOM formula from the company that has nicotinol gabba. It has kava in it just a very low amount of kava and it’s got CBD and CBG. So CBD and CBG, so cannabinoids, cbd especially modulate the gabba system too. And there’s a drug called Epidialox that’s actually approved for seizures. That is very, very high dose. It’s like a thousand milligrams of CBD or something ridiculous like that, and that’s a very, very high dose compared to what we have in our products. And what you find in most products is anywhere between five milligrams in our product to somewhere maybe 25 to 50 milligrams is a high dose of CBD. But that’s modulating not only the endocannabinoid system in various ways. So the internal system in our body that regulates homeostasis, basically balance, is called the endocannabinoid system. And then the cannabis plan has these compounds in it that modulate that system, one of them being CBD, and so CBD has an effect on the gabba system as well. So does CBG. Now THC is actually interesting. Thc is actually inhibitory. So that’s why some people can feel anxiety when they take THC. Is that they can. Some people have this inhibitory feeling of that gabba receptor. They get anxiety, they get stress, they think they’re gonna die and all those kinds of things. So I don’t do THC. Do you do THC? 

David: 29:42

My last pot brownie was about 40 years ago. And I will never, ever do that again. It was horrible. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 29:49

Brownies are dangerous. Yeah, I have my own pot brownie story from maybe about how many years ago now? Yeah, about 30 years ago. 

David: 29:57

Oh, my God. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 29:58

There’s so many problems with that. But I think the problem is when you’re ingesting THC you don’t know how much you’re getting oftentimes and because you have like a brownie and then you can have like one little piece of the brownie, that’s all the cannabis and everything else is nothing. You don’t know, and that’s one problem and that’s you know, when we have our, we make something called trochies at our company and like there’s these dissolvable lozenges that are scored and so you can break them up into quarters, halves and fulls. And we were very clear when we were making that, like we didn’t wanna have the brownie effect where it was like in one quarter you had all the ingredients and everything else was nothing. So we have a very significant process where we go have a go through a compounding pharmacy and we make sure everything is mixed well, we test everything to make sure that it’s not your pop brownie kind of thing, like yeah, my experience is it’s actually kind of funny and in retrospect, like my parents read a town, I was like 14 or 15. And we all we cooked up a whole bunch of brownies. We went to a concert. I spent the entire concert with my head between my legs, angry. 

David: 30:58

Make it stop, make it stop, make it stop. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 31:00

Because it was like one of my favorite bands of all time is Jimmy Page and the Black Rose. I was so excited about going and I was. I couldn’t even move. I was like I was basically like a piece of marble in my seat, so anyway. So I feel I’m sure people that are listening have their own pot edible stories and that’s pot that was like 30 years ago. That was not even close to the kind of THC content that is in the types of things that are around these days. But anyway, be aware of your edible brownies even still. 

David: 31:33

I think the age limit on that stuff should be about 18. If you’re under 18, okay. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 31:37

Or, if possible, wait to do all your drugs until after your 25 years old, if you can. 

David: 31:41

Oh yeah, so your brain’s fully formed so that’s oh right, so you don’t. Well, maybe that’s what happened to me and now I know. Yeah yeah, yeah. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 31:50

You’re not the only one my friend. It’s okay. 

David: 31:53

There’s a compound in tea which I think is called alfany. Is that right, alfany? Yeah, alfany. Does that intersect with the GABA system? 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 32:00

It does. It does modulate the GABA system as well. Yeah, and it does it in a and actually in a way. That’s kind of not well understood, but it actually works on the GABA receptor too. So if you want to relax, right, you want more GABA is what it comes down to. And so if you want to relax and you want more GABA, there are all these things you can take. But you can also stop doing shit, which means, like, you can go start meditating. You can meditate, you can do breath work, you can become more parasympathetic. This is basically changing your balance over from being sympathetic, go, go, go to relaxing, right? So relaxation, breath work, meditation practices these are all been studied in those clinical trials and studies and things and showing that that’ll enhance GABA in the brain, and so you can do that. Actually, exercise also enhances the balance, or optimize the balance, between glutamate and GABA as well. So you can have, you’ll have more GABA after you’ve exercised. If you become more sympathetic. In something like exercise or in like something like I’m just thinking like cold thermogenesis, for example, you’re going to stimulate a whole bunch of stress hormones, but then you’re going to have a rebound where the body is going to recalibrate itself right. So stressing the body is still a good thing, but you want to have your periods of relaxation. So those are some. It’s always important to remember that if you’re feeling stressed, if you’re feeling anxious at least in my world, like I’m thinking about this clinically I’m like, okay, these people need more GABA in their life, right, and how can we give this to them? We can get more glutamine containing foods. We can do all that. We can optimize their vitamins, minerals and nutrients. Make sure they have enough B6, enough magnesium, making sure they have good energy capacity, making sure they don’t have a leaky gut, a leaky brain. These are all things that are very, very important. And then we can give them supplements or herbals and things like that to help with that system while you’re on the process of trying to optimize it. I mean, hypothetically, we should need something to help us go to bed at night, but many of us do, and especially when we travel or we have a stressful project or we have type A personalities and we don’t let our mind. Our mind has a hard time shutting off and sometimes we need things, and that’s completely fine too. It’s, I think. You know, mia, I think well enough already, dave to know is like I’m always in the context of. It’s not like there’s one magic thing that’s going to help for every situation. You just want to have your sort of cadre of things available to you, depending on the situation, but have your basic foundational stuff in order as much as you can. 

David: 34:14

You bring up exercise. What I find is that now when I exercise hard, my sympathetic system is really revved. After the workout I try and give myself like 10 minutes of breathing. I put on music and stuff, but still it’s jacked for a couple of hours. I can’t do sauna like at night because it’s too sympathetically activating. Actually, I’m too jacked and I can’t go to sleep. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 34:38

Yeah, that’s a common problem in the sense that, but usually the problem is not so much people are aware of what’s happening, in the sense that the problem typically is they’re doing a whole bunch of Wim Hof breathing, they’re doing a whole bunch of cold thermogenesis. They’re just like going balls out all the rest of the day and not giving themselves any time to rest. Then they start burning out as a result of that. I have people that cold plunging is all the rage. But if you’re doing this every day but you’re not giving yourself time to relax and find ways to get back to parasympathetic, it’s going to catch up to you over time. This is obviously the problem of everything in a human condition If something’s good, we want to do more of it and more and more and more. That’s usually the issue that I have with most of them, that the clients that I work with is that they’re not giving themselves the. They’re giving themselves the hormetic stress, but they’re not letting themselves come on down. What I would do in those cases is I would start working on things like HRV training. Hrv training is really good. I guess it’s sort of a post-workout kind of thing you actually can work on your HRV with. There’s a lot of different types of ways you can do this, but one of them is something called HeartMath, which I’m sure you’ve heard about before. But HeartMath is a company that’s been doing HRV training forever. There’s even something you can get for your phone. I used to do it all the time a number of years ago, but it actually goes. It clips onto your ear and then you have a little thing that goes into your phone and you can measure your breathing. So measure how you’re breathing, rates your depth, and get a sense of that, some feedback. That can be helpful. So training HRV can be very helpful. Also, positioning can be very helpful, in the sense that oftentimes if people are having a hard time with parasympathetic rebound, then actually lying down instead of lying, being up and making yourself completely flat, is really, really helpful. Yoga need what’s it called? Yoga need? I think it’s like when you’re doing corpus poses and things like that, so really trying to relax is helpful. I also find that low amounts of heat, like an infrared sauna, can sometimes be good as opposed to a finished sauna, like a finished high heat sauna, because that’s more of a stress on the system as opposed to like, for example, for me. I do infrared sauna most evenings before I go to bed. I don’t feel like that really creates a huge amount of stress response. But there are people and I know these people too that do. They do the hot cold before they go to bed at night, using the finished sauna. They use high heat and then they use cold as well, and they can go back and forth and as long as I think they have to finish off in heat before they go to bed, and that typically works. But it doesn’t work for me either. It’s like certain people are just more wired to be more sympathetically dominant and if you’re listening, this is somebody that’s more Taipei in general, right. So if you’re more like you’re organized, you’re getting shit done like you have a planner, like you know, that’s typically like you’re more of a Taipei person and so it’s harder to wind down. But even people like yourself can be very sensitive to the GABA stuff, so you have to be careful there. But you can even start adding a little bit of this stuff in, like Althianine is a pretty good one, or like a little bit of Kava, like a little bit of you know, whenever we make something at my company, it’s like it’s always very, very low dose, or it can be titrated to low dose and kind of go up, because we always know that there’s going to be people that are going to be very sensitive on both ends of the spectrum here. 

David: 38:01

Fascinating. You mentioned something before we got on the call about nasal spray and sleep. This is a totally new one on me. Well, this is. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 38:11

Well. So I mean, look the bigger picture here. You and I, dave, talk about a lot of sort of health and wellness kinds of things and how we’re optimizing and we’re always doing experiments. I mean, I’m always doing experiments on myself, whether I do them accidentally or not, is that’s always the fun of it? So, like this morning, I got a whole bunch of blood work done and I was like you know what’s the day going to bring as a result of not having, you know, 250 cc less, of having 250 cc less of blood? I don’t know. I’m still able to converse with you, I’m still talking. That’s good. I did have a whole bunch of salt afterwards and things to increase my blood pressure a little bit. But yeah, for me I was just telling you before we talked that sleep is something that I measure. I know you measure your sleep as well. So I have an oral ring and I do notice, ever since I moved to Colorado a couple of years ago, that I will get these little blips in my sleep. Where I get the sort of oxygen level is not optimal and I’m not fat, I don’t have any sort of, I don’t snore, I don’t have sleep apnea. I don’t think, although I haven’t done a full test, I’m pretty sure, and so and I’m a side sleeper, but you know I was like, well, and then just happens that one of my daughters is sick in the house, and when I have, when you have four kids going through, oftentimes you’ll get whatever they get, no matter how optimized you are. Like it’s like I call it like a bolus load, like it’s like a certain load you can tolerate, but when you have like children that are like all over you and like it’s only so much that you can do right. So but I was like I’ll just start spraying some nose, some nasal spray. I have this like xylitol saline nasal spray that I have at the house that I travel with. I recommend everybody travel with something like this too. Actually really important to travel with something like this and just use it when you get off the plane or especially when you go to bed that night when you get off the plane. It’s one of it’s really helpful Because you’re always going to. This is where often our respiratory, viral kinds of things are going to get housed is in our nasal spray and nasal passages. You guys all know this now from COVID and flu. It’s like you know that’s where your nasal swabs blah, blah. So anyway, so I have this at the house, so I was using it the last couple of days and my deep sleep went up for 20 to 30 minutes every each of the nights. I use it and I had no oxygen dips at all. I’m like, oh, obviously it makes sense, I’m just getting, because it’s drier air here in Colorado from where I used to live in California. It’s going to get drier at night, and so my nasal patches might get more blocked, and so, as a result of that, it’s probably affecting my deep sleep If I’m not able to take deep breaths right, and so hence the extra deep sleep with just a nasal spray in the evening. So little things, little things, but that was pretty cool to see. 

David: 40:43

Wow, I love that kind of stuff. As we discussed earlier, anything that I can help me, you know, be a better version of David is. But it’s not like a pill I have to swallow. That I’m into. I swallow enough things. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 40:56

Yeah, well, we have trokies, as you know, at my company, so they don’t have to swallow them. They actually dissolve in your mouth as well, which is kind of nice, but but it’s still something to put in your mouth. You know, I don’t have that many things that I do that are nasal sprays. That’s not very common. There are people that use ketamine nasal sprays and oxytocin nasal sprays and things like that for various purposes. Oxytocin is a really interesting one. If you haven’t played around with that, oxytocin is the is the love drug. It’s the love hormone that gets released for bonding relationships, breastfeeding for women. Yeah, taking oxytocin at a party is actually better than drinking alcohol as far as I’m concerned. So it’s because you take 10 or 20 IUs of oxytocin, everybody feels warm and bubbly and connected and it’s better. So, as we like to say at transcriptions, we have better drugs than alcohol for all these kinds of. 

David: 41:42

Is it what MDMA does? 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 41:45

So MDMA increases serotonin and it’s also an amphetamine at the same time. So it increases dopamine and norepinephrine at the same time. So it’s a very unusual drug because you have your psilocybins, honokiol, and your LSDs, which are mostly serotonin, and you have MDMA, which is very high serotonin, but also norepinephrine and dopamine as well. So it doesn’t affect. It works on a very different system. It’s mostly serotonin. 

David: 42:12

We’ve talked about all kinds of interesting things here. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 42:14

Always, but next time, I see. But oxytocin is one you should try if it’s a good one for a party where you have it like a small group, like three to four people. 20 IUs of oxytocin this is a prescription, ladies and gentlemen. You have to get it compounded. Although there are places, I think you can get it online. Now I don’t know the sources. I can’t vouch for any of them at all, so don’t blame me for anything. 

David: 42:37

I don’t know. So wait, scott. So you want me to go to my doc and say I’m going to have a party. I want to feel really good. Can you give me a prescription for oxytocin? 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 42:47

So the prescription is for social anxiety, that’s what people use it for. So if you’re anxious in social situations, oxytocin can help. It’s used in autistic children that have social challenges because it makes them feel connected. It makes them so it can be used. So we have trocom at transcriptions. It also works because it’s got the nicotin on GABA there, which doesn’t make you too tired, but it’s got the CBD and CBG. It’s got a little bit of Kava, so it’s great for social situations as well. It’s not just another option, so it’s not something that easily to be. You can buy transcriptions. You can’t buy oxytocin for them. There are places you can buy over the counter. I just don’t know. I don’t know about quality and things like that, so I just want to be careful there. But yes, you could go to your doctor and say if you are socially anxious, it is something to potentially try, absolutely. 

David: 43:36

I’ve talked already. He’s like you want to do what With what? Why do you want to do that? 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 43:43

Yeah, yeah, I think you know, as I grew up the son of a chiropractor, so almost everything is not surprising to me, Because most people that went to a chiropractor 30 or 40 years ago, I mean they were off the grid now, but they were really off the grid back then. So it’s like you could imagine all the kinds of crazy things that people would be doing or trying or playing with, and that’s probably where I got the itch to do all this crazy stuff too. 

David: 44:07

I’m going to ask you a performance enhancing question. Okay, so what I have noticed, so I’ve taken up this hobby of ski racing and part of this, what I’ve learned, is that the ability to focus and even I do a lot of balanced stability stuff on one foot or eyes closed one foot what I found the key to making that work is that I just imagine myself going fast and having to make a gate, and so that sort of focuses my mind. I’m able to, like stay on my foot with my eyes closed longer. So this is a focused thing. And when I go to PT, there’s also sort of a lot of like one-legged, really focused things. My question is so I’m up around the hill and it’s like, okay, we’re going to run some gates today or something we mentioned, I think, before the podcast. Some people were taking some of the Olympic sprinters. They got a little trouble for this. They were taking, like anti-narcolepsy drugs, yep, and then maybe you don’t go that route and I want to really focus on things but not be like. Caffeine makes me really tense, it sort of over-activates the mental part and what I want to do is to activate the sensory response part. If that makes sense, yes, what? 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 45:27

do I do. There is a lot of options here. I wouldn’t even thought about saying this on a podcast a couple of years ago, but I think it’s okay now. So I mean, the first step is that when you’re thinking about focus, you’re thinking about certain neurotransmitters that help with focus. The neurotransmitters that help with focus are typically dopamine and norepinephrine, because these are more of our stress reward types of neurotransmitters. You think about acetylcholine as well. Acetylcholine is a neurotransmitter that helps with our brain, our function of our memory, our cognition, and all kind of goes together here. So one of the things that I think about, we created a product called something called blue canotine at transcriptions, which is something that you’ve tried. That is very low dose nicotine, caffeine, CBD and methylene blue, and people get scared about nicotine, but that’s kind of where I was going with. The first part of this conversation is that nicotine is a fantastic cognitive enhancer. It’s very short acting. It’s about one to two hours and if you don’t smoke it or vape it, keep it very low dose less than four milligrams a day. The chance of addiction is like minutely small, minuscule. So it’s very, very powerful and very quick, and so for people that are looking to feel more of a cognitive edge. They can actually just have some nicotine on its own and it will do that. But what’s nice about the formula that we created is that you have caffeine in there just a small amount a quarter cup of coffee and then you have CBD, which kind of rounds it out and makes it so it’s not too stimulating. Cbd is neuroprotective. Cbd increases your bliss neurotransmitter, something called anandamide. Ananda comes from the word. The root of the word comes from a Sanskrit word for bliss actually. So anandamide is a neurotransmitter that increases when you have CBD around. And then methylene blue is a fantastic mitochondrial optimizer, so it helps with energy production, helps with antioxidant reserve, things like that. So it’s a really nice focus flow for three to five hours. So if you’re looking for focus, for flow for three to five hours without any come down or crash, you can something you can titrate. Either just a quarter of a trokey can be enough for some people, a half or a full depending on the day. You can really make that experience, what you’re describing. I think you’ve had that experience too, right, Dave? Yeah absolutely yeah, yeah. So you can use that and I’ve had a good experiences with that. The other thing you can do is if this is legal in your country, state, province, whatever is that. Dosing with things like a micro dose of LSD or psilocybin had the ability for you to create the creativity and the expansiveness, but they’re usually not enough, in the sense that if you want to be able to focus with those, typically you have to have some sort of stimulant along with it. So if it’s legal, if it’s in wherever you live, again, they do all these things. A good combination is a micro dose of LSD or psilocybin plus blue-counted teen. That’s my favorite If I’m in a place like Denver where these things are decriminalized or something like that, especially for psilocybin micro dosing, for example. So I didn’t learn this myself. This is from my crazy clients and things like that that do all these things and tell me what their experiences are for the most part, but it is a fantastic combination. So if you have the ability to have more, let’s call it, you have better vision, more expansiveness, you have more hyperconnectivity in various areas of the brain that aren’t usually connected, and then you have the ability to focus and increase, enhance your memory at the same time. It’s really kind of a superhero combination. It’s what it comes down to. 

David: 48:54

I recall a baseball pitcher. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 48:59

Who was it? 

David: 49:01

It was like in the 70s, who pitched a no hitter, like totally tripping on acid, really, yeah, yeah, I forget his name. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 49:12

I got to look that up. That’s something. 

David: 49:14

And he described it as I just dropped the ball in the tunnel. I love that. I don’t think there’s anything else happening. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 49:22

He just dropped the ball, doc Ellis. 

David: 49:24

Doc Ellis. Yes, that was it, doc Ellis. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 49:28

Acid. No hitter was 47 years ago. Wow, I didn’t know that. That’s awesome. Yeah, I mean I wouldn’t recommend like being on a full dose. That’s crazy. But you know, sub perceptible doses of these kinds of things can enhance creativity At least we think that they can, and so it’s not something that I say lightly and not just not for everybody. Certainly you have to make sure you have reliable sources of these things. There’s all these sort of caveats and please make sure that people are listening to all these caveats but there is the but that there is potential for these to be therapeutic in a lot of different ways. And creativity I think it’s a fantastic one. And the expansiveness of being able to see things before you would naturally see them like on a ski hill, for example, but maintaining focus at the same time. So that’s kind of the superhero way of doing this. I love blue canotine for it. If it’s a very short acting kind of thing where I need focus, concentration for two, three hours, I’ll just have a little piece of nicotine gum, very small dose, typically nicotine replacements, either two milligrams or four milligrams. I don’t recommend starting there. Start right. I start like a half a milligram or a full, like one milligram of nicotine, because nicotine can also be. It can make you feel jittery and also can give you diarrhea if you’re not careful. If you have a higher dose, it’s going to make you go poop. I can’t use it. 

David: 50:50

What is a? 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 50:51

laxative. Ladies and gentlemen, I wouldn’t use it that way. There’s better ways to go poop. 

David: 50:57

Show up with my coaches and my tongues bright blue, damn right Come on Highly focused. I’m like what’s dude up to today? 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 51:06

Dave is rocking it. We always say at transcriptions I mean, we used to just have two products that were based on methylene blue and our tagline was blue is the new smart right, Because these are trochies that go up and dissolve in your mouth. They make your tongue blue. Our full methylene blue trochee the one that doesn’t have the stimulants you can actually swallow as well, but either way it’s going to come out blue, meaning that you’re going to have urine that turns a little bit blue when you take these, because methylene blue concentrates in the urine. So it’s just something to be aware of that. You are going to have a little bit of a blue urine if you do this, but side effect benign. No problems there. It’s more about the effect that we care about. It’s just it’s a good party trick in some ways. That’s actually true because these because methylene blue is actually used in laboratory analysis as well, and so lab technicians would bring it home and put it in the cookie mix or something like that, and so everybody would have the methylene blue in the cookies and everybody would be urinating blue. And that was like a fun party trick. It’s real, it’s something that has been done. 

David: 52:05

Something like something I would do in college, Like exactly yeah. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 52:07

Yeah, lsd in the punch, or methylene blue in the punch, or maybe both, I don’t know. No recommendations, no listen. Anything I’m saying about that, about any drugs, please. Yes, the show is only informational purpose. 

David: 52:23

Informational and entertainment. We’re not. This is nothing prescription here, just be clear on that. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 52:28

Yeah, yeah. The idea is like educating about the whole system of GABA is really important, I think, because, when it comes down to it, if you’re having a lot of anxiety, if you’re having a lot of stress, even if you’re super depressed, actually it could be because you’re GABA deficient. So I feel unusual to you to think about, but when we’re, do you know how many thoughts, on average, the average person has on a daily basis? 

David: 52:50

10,000, 100,000, I don’t know, it’s endless. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 52:53

So 70,000 on average is what they’ve got. So if you’re depressed or anxious, it’s up to 120,000. So it’s actually similar that you just compulsively commiserate or you just perseverate on the same thoughts over and over again. So that’s a lot of thoughts. So if we can tamp that down, if we can damper it down with something with increased GABA tone, increasing GABA in the brain, you’re going to decrease the amount of thoughts that you have. And in fact, there’s just a drug that was just approved by I can’t remember what the company is, but it’s a new drug, that’s it’s actually a GABA drug for postpartum depression. So it’s the first drug approved for postpartum depression and it’s affecting the GABA system. So the GABA system is a big deal and I think the drug companies are getting. They’ve known about this for a while. They’re just like addicting people with their benzos and things like that, and I don’t know about this particular drug and how it’s going to go. But you know that the rest of the antidepressants are very, very hard to get off of as well. So but it could be easier, I don’t know, because we have some natural equivalents on the GABA side that may make it easier for us to get. We need people off some of these drugs, but maybe people don’t have to go on them if they know that there’s are these other alternatives. I say that with a grain of salt. If you’re you know, if you’re having a really hard time, like these drugs can be very, very helpful. I don’t know about this new GABA drug, but certainly if you’re in a bad place, you know, sometimes these drugs can be very, very helpful and I want to make sure and acknowledge that, and I have friends that you know wouldn’t be alive if they didn’t take some of these drugs when they had a really bad time. Especially, postpartum depression can be really, really challenging on women, so anyway, so just to put that in context yeah, absolutely yeah, Depression is a really is a very serious thing. 

David: 54:32

Yeah, 100% Scott. If, if somebody out there wants to get in touch with you, what would they do? 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 54:39

Yeah, so my company that makes some of the products that we were describing today, something called Trocom, and Tro Z is our new sleep remedy. That’ll be out, hopefully by the end of October, if all goes well. Troscriptionscom is the place to go. So the word trokey and the word prescription mashed up into one word tro descriptions. We make trokeys. There’s all the lozenges and we have as prescription grade as possible. We’re all clinicians there’s four docs in the team including me. So we’re on Instagram at transcriptions, at transcriptionscom. That’s where you can find stuff about my company, about the nonprofit that is training doctors and practitioners. If you’re a practitioner, you’re interested. You can go to homehopeorg Health optimization medicine and practice is the name. Homehopeorg is the website For my personal practice. A couple of ways to get me you can go to Dr Scotchercom Dr S-E-O-T-T-S-H-E-R-Rcom. I’m on Instagram at Dr Scotcher, spelled the same way. And yeah, those are the main places I think. And you can also reach out to Dave and he can get you connected. If there’s anything, I do consulting all over the world using the framework that I use with concierge medicine, health optimization medicine, and I also am very involved, as we know, in hyperbaric oxygen therapy and I do a lot of consulting in clinics and places around the world doing that too. 

David: 55:54

Super Scott, somebody told me the other day my conversations with you are the most information dense podcasts like they’ve ever heard. So I really appreciate that. 

Dr. Scott Sherr: 56:05

Not a problem, I guess. I’m not the type that could stick on one single thing and talk about it forever. So it’s my type one brain. So I appreciate the time. Dave, this is always fun. Absolutely Great to speak.